From: Bill Roh (billroh@churchofvirus.com)
Date: Mon Jan 07 2002 - 11:42:59 MST
I'll give you a little different perspective than the honorable Hermit.
Aside from what the Hermit lists, some I agree with, and much I don't, my
observations speak to a much different reality - Political Correctness.
Here in the Southwest United States, you will hear very little support for
Israel. Frankly, we don't care. It's only the demonization of the Palestinians
and the rest of the Arab world that has your average man willing to support
Israel. Where do they get demonized at? EVERYWHERE. In school we are taught
about the holocaust, but we are not told about how awful the German's were, but
how we should have helped sooner. It's become an issue of appealing to our
"guilt" and using that emotion to extort all the money they can from the
country. Neither the Republican party or Democrats will cross them for the
reason that there would be an anti-Semitic outcry. Here in the west, a
politician could probably survive the calls of anti-Semitism.
Then I went to live in Boston
Never in my life have I seen one group of people so willing to call foul at
every opportunity. When in Boston I would say that perhaps half the people I
knew were Jewish. About half of those were your average person (or I should say
very similar to myself). The other half fit every stereotype I have ever heard
of the American Jew. My Jewish boss fit the stereotype perfectly. He was out for
every penny he could get by any means, was very Israel centric, hated the Arabs,
etc... Once, for the Super bowl, he asked me to go buy a big screen TV on my
company credit card, then return the TV a few days after the Super bowl.
Basically making the set unsellable as new and costing the dealer hundreds of
dollars. Then, when I called him and that behavior "dishonest" and said that I
had more integrity than that, he suggested that I was insulting the Jewish
people and anti-Semitic. Well, if I wasn't before that comment, I was certainly
leaning that way afterwards. Suffice it to say that in my 5 years of Boston
Jewish person experiences, this type of behavior, behavior that I find
reprehensible, was a very frequent event. Even the Jewish people who were good
friends often displayed such "me first" attitudes frequently with one exception.
My friend Steve Black, whom I name specifically simply because he is such a good
friend and has demonstrated a selfless goodwill towards myself and family, proof
that there are good people everywhere one looks.
I don't see any way that an East Coast politician could so much as suggest that
Israelis are murdering people as opposed to defending themselves and still have
a job 6 months later. It is a wealthy and powerful lobby preying on:
1> Americans misplaced guilt about the holocaust
2> America's inability to "pull out" of it's own bad decision making
3> Playing the anti-Semitism card at any and every opportunity thereby making
your critics look racist.
4> The knowledge that for the most part, Americas short memory plays into the
hands of Israelis in that we forget about most Israeli atrocities somewhere
between a week and a year later.
5> Guilt again, this time though" "If anything happens to Israel, It's Americas
fault" (and sure enough there are people on this list who would blame the US if
Israel fell and will blame us if they thrive)
And that reminds me: A GENERAL COMPLAINT! Every country and person are
responsible for the actions they take. Some say that "The US trained Bin Laden,
so it's their fault Osama is a killer".
WRONG - Osama is responsible for himself. It was not our training the birthed
him, or taught him his hatreds. He is an independent individual. We gave him the
tools to fight a battle that was genuinely good. What he chose to do with those
tools afterwards is his choice. Think of all the world wide students who have
come to the US for their College Education - Should we get credit for their
discoveries and inventions? "Indeed - it's not Lee Su that discovered that
incredible alloy, it's MIT who trained him with a grant from the US Govt. It's
our discovery! Who cares that it was made in Taiwan, the inventor was trained in
the States, it's our fault!"
Some would say: "The US gives money to Israel so the US is responsible for
Israelis actions" Again - poppycock. We give over 2 billion to Egypt too, are we
responsible for all the woes or good things in Egypt? NO.
enough rambling I spose - I'm getting off topic. So to sum up in two sentences:
The USs support of Israel is based on the deep seated emotions of guilt and a
fear of Jewish verbal retaliation. Break the American Guilt cycle, and support
for Israel will stop.
Best to you all
Bill
L' Ermit wrote:
> Richard mentioned:
> I suppose it could simply be support for a democratic nation against a
> militant and fanatical Islamic block, but that hardly seems commensurate
> with paying out massive amounts of financial support to many of Israel's
> staunchly undemocratic neighbours). Or am I complicating the issue?
>
> ===
> Hermit comments and suggests that Richard is perhaps missing the "key" to
> disentangling this particular Gordian knot:
>
> The US only has interests - not policies, and the interests of the
> fundamentalists in this case aligns with the interests of the "Jewish
> liberals" upon whose support the Democrats rely.
>
> The theft of the Palestine by the Israelis, aided and abetted by the
> Christian Fundamentalists of the US (and other Christian Fundamentalists
> around the world) was quite "logical" from said Fundamentalists' perspective
> as it is a necessary prequel to the Armageddon which said fundamentalists
> see as required to make the drug-induced nightmares of Revelations occur to
> restore their gods to life.
>
> Given that the Republican's rely on the fanatical fundamentalist 30% of the
> US population for their power base, and that Dubya is seen as the "natural
> leader" of this group, I find their support for Israel completely
> understandable. The simple fact that the Democrats rely on the support of a
> group whose relatives are cherished by the Republicans ensures that the
> Democrats have the same "interests" - which is why Israel will continue to
> thrive under either party.
>
> A country where more than 50% of the native population has been driven out
> of the country and is living in internment camps in other countries, and
> where the other 50% of the native population are voteless and marginalized
> by the terror of being assaulted by heavy weaponry (in large supplied by the
> US) hardly meets the usual modern definition of "democratic." In fact, if it
> were not for the above, Israel would undoubtedly be labeled a "terrorist
> nation" by the US. As it is, Israel has grabbed Bush's rhetoric of
> "unlimited warfare against terrorists" and is cheerfully applying it to
> their treatment of the Palestinians - while the "democratic" nations look on
> and cheer.
>
> Given that Israel soaks up 60% of all US foreign aid at some $5 billion plus
> per year, with the rest scattered over the entire globe, it seems strange to
> see reference to "massive amounts" of financial support to her neighbors.
> Perhaps it is rather that US aid to Israel's very undemocratic neighbors,
> comprises the payment of the minimum necessary Danegeld - which would be
> politically unacceptable within Israel if it were made directly by Israel -
> and besides, it is cheaper to let the "Yanks" do it for so long as they are
> willing. Given all the above, this might be a very long time.
>
> This would all be quite incomprehensible without recognizing the religious
> motivations underpinning the fact that the Jews, as the "chosen people" of
> the gods, "can do no wrong" - and when it appears that they are doing wrong,
> that this is merely part of the gods' "beautiful plan for mankind".
>
> In the long term, the only real hope for the sorry situation is that the
> people of Israel might eventually become horrified at what they themselves
> are doing - but while terror rules, blood flows and religious fanaticism
> thrives, this is probably too much to hope for.
>
> Regards
>
> Hermit
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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